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White to Play http://prod.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=10192 |
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Author: | logan [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 8:34 pm ] |
Post subject: | White to Play |
Noriyuki Nakayama 7p, Tales of Men Crazy about Go, trans. John Power (Abridged) wrote: Some years after I had learnt to play go, I encountered an extraordinarily strong player in a Shinjuku go club. [H]e was a descendent of a samurai. He sat down heavily on the tatami mat, placed the bowl with the white stones between his knees, looked doubtfully at me and muttered: "Shall we have you try three stones?" I was stupefied. I played on even with Takeda Toshiro, the strongest player at this go club. With three stones, I was confident I could hold my own even against Go Seigen, who at this time was at his peak. This game took place 30 years ago, but I still remember the fuseki. The moves up to 22 are the perfectly ordinary two-space pincer joseki. While I was wondering how White could expect to win playing straight forward moves like this, the samurai played in a strange place with 25. I now realize 25 is a magnificent move. I had no idea how to answer. "What's up? You're taking your time," laughed the samurai. I don't remember how I played after this, but I do remember that White forced me to resign. This samurai was Takehara Kintaro, known and feared throughout the amateur go world as 'Devil Takehara'. He enjoyed his heyday in the period before the Kikuchi-Murakami group came to prominence. Some people dismissed him as a braggart, but this was because of his unconventional personality. Year later, at a function organized by the magazine, he scored an easy win on black against Watanabe Shokichi 9-dan, which shows that he was no mere braggart. So where did White play 25? ![]() |
Author: | moyoaji [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 8:43 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Author: | Shenoute [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 5:03 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
I remember reading this in a Go World ![]() "You've played 10 moves and all you've done is create a target for white to attack" (or something like that, I'm quoting from memory). |
Author: | skydyr [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:39 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Author: | Uberdude [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:38 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Author: | logan [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
I'll post the solution tomorrow. Give you all another day ![]() |
Author: | DrStraw [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:49 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
This game does not look familiar so I looked in the Treasure Chest Enigma. I cannot find it in there. Are you sure that is the source? |
Author: | logan [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 3:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
A slip, it was taken from Tales of Men Crazy about Go, the sequel to the source of the The Treasure Chest Enigma. Were you trying to cheat DrStraw? ![]() |
Author: | DrStraw [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 4:15 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
logan wrote: A slip, it was taken from Tales of Men Crazy about Go, the sequel to the source of the The Treasure Chest Enigma. Were you trying to cheat DrStraw? ![]() No, I just was pretty sure I had not seen it and also was confident that I would remember it had it been in that book. In other words, had your reference been correct I probably would already know the answer. |
Author: | logan [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 4:21 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Well, now that you know that you don't know I want to know: can you figure it out so you'll know? |
Author: | DrStraw [ Tue Apr 22, 2014 4:32 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
logan wrote: Well, now that you know that you don't know I want to know: can you figure it out so you'll know? No. I stopped studying 25 years ago. And this is the study group so I don't have a chance. |
Author: | oca [ Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:49 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Author: | logan [ Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:27 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
oca is right, the answer is tengen once again. Let's see the reasoning: |
Author: | skydyr [ Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:50 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
logan wrote: ... So close, and yet so far... |
Author: | DrStraw [ Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
logan wrote: oca is right, the answer is tengen once again. Let's see the reasoning: Well, I didn't analyze it but based on the context of the thread I looked for something really bizarre. I thought of the attachment one point above and to the left of the real answer. But, as I said, that was so bizarre it could not be correct. Nice to see that with my declining ability I can still be in the general area. ![]() |
Author: | oca [ Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Author: | Connection [ Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:53 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
I am not quite sure if I understand correctly, so why would white "e" be annoying after black played "d"? |
Author: | gowan [ Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:28 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
This story was translated by John Power and published in Go World issue number 50 (winter 1987-1988). There are other good stories in that issue, including the one which became the origin of the story about wearing down of the nail the right hand index finger. Just a small sample of the wonders available in the DVDs of Go World ![]() Connection, WHite "e" would be annoying to Black because it would block the large black group from access to the left side and also, at the same time, enlarge White's potential territory there. |
Author: | logan [ Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:41 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: White to Play |
Connection wrote: I am not quite sure if I understand correctly, so why would white "e" be annoying after black played "d"? Because if White played 'e' first, Black would most certainly not reply with 'd'. So after White 25, Black 'd'. White 'e' it's as though Black was forced to play 'd' after White 'e'. A very painful result. This sort of move analysis is called, 'tewari' analysis.
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