Life In 19x19
http://prod.lifein19x19.com/

A super thrilling fighting game
http://prod.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10142
Page 1 of 1

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:02 am ]
Post subject:  A super thrilling fighting game



Attachments:
oOryougiOo(W) vs prism(B).sgf [1.71 KiB]
Downloaded 551 times

Author:  kivi [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

In the fight at the upper side, black had so many chances to make L14 live, after which all white dies.

S7 / M9 / L8, all could be Q19, then upper w dies or at least temporarily seki. And later middle w (n11 group) dies.

Author:  Splatted [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

Which player are you?

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

kivi wrote:
In the fight at the upper side, black had so many chances to make L14 live, after which all white dies.

S7 / M9 / L8, all could be Q19, then upper w dies or at least temporarily seki. And later middle w (n11 group) dies.



Could you tell me from which move onward?

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

Splatted wrote:
Which player are you?


I am oOryougiOo. You can find me on Tygem :-)

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

BaoTran wrote:
kivi wrote:
In the fight at the upper side, black had so many chances to make L14 live, after which all white dies.

S7 / M9 / L8, all could be Q19, then upper w dies or at least temporarily seki. And later middle w (n11 group) dies.



Could you tell me from which move onward?



Nvm, I found it. Yes i'd be seki, but W'd have sente and make life for n11 group, no? In that case W's still leading by ~20 points i think

Author:  kivi [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

BaoTran wrote:
kivi wrote:
In the fight at the upper side, black had so many chances to make L14 live, after which all white dies.

S7 / M9 / L8, all could be Q19, then upper w dies or at least temporarily seki. And later middle w (n11 group) dies.



Could you tell me from which move onward?

After white 182, middle white group can have only one eye. So black should focus on filling N17 group's outer dame, with moves like q19. Black can even pass twice, and all white (upper and middle) will still eventually die.

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 6:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

kivi wrote:
BaoTran wrote:
kivi wrote:
In the fight at the upper side, black had so many chances to make L14 live, after which all white dies.

S7 / M9 / L8, all could be Q19, then upper w dies or at least temporarily seki. And later middle w (n11 group) dies.



Could you tell me from which move onward?

After white 182, middle white group can have only one eye. So black should focus on filling N17 group's outer dame, with moves like q19. Black can even pass twice, and all white (upper and middle) will still eventually die.


Thought it was earlier. You are right, I'd have lost in that case

Author:  Splatted [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 6:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

BaoTran wrote:
Splatted wrote:
Which player are you?


I am oOryougiOo. You can find me on Tygem :-)


Sorry, I was going to review this game but it's just too complicated. I'll try and see if I can find something worthwhile to say but a proper review is out of my league. :blackeye:

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 6:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

BaoTran wrote:
kivi wrote:
d focus on filling N17 group's outer dame, with moves like q19. Black can even pass twice, and all white (upper and middle) will still eventually die.


Thought it was earlier. You are right, I'd have lost in that case


Then maybe W could try S7 instead of E15 at move 170, i'd be seki at top and W's n11 would live :?:

Author:  kivi [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

Yes, at 170 you should play S7 to live with that group. But the top is not seki, white's n17 group is dead, and black can even tenuki.

If white tries to kill blacks top group, black can kill n17 quite fast. In the game he tried to kill the other group which has many liberties, and then killed himself in the process.

Author:  StlenVlr [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

The best I can tell, the game was ultra blitz with 10min absolute time, and the game ending with W being dead from move 182 to 192, then B making 150pt misplay and losing semeai that's roughly half the board worth.

Such games are not often that useful for reviewing purposes. It's very difficult to critique games when obviously driving factor behind every misplay was lack of time to think. You kinda could give hints to finding good direction of play, but with games that are only about fighting and close semeais, that aspect is overshadowed by the required intuition and flash reading, neither of which you can really communicate to another person.

That being said, here's list of things about direction of play I think you should pay attention to:

:w30: White should extend along the bot, maybe with L4. You don't have any good opportunities to develop your shape on the right side, but you'd really like getting some profit from this fight. take the profit.
:b61: B missed the opportunity to kill W(or completely destroy W corner) here. Before this, B spend many moves on center group instead of playing Q13. Outside the 193 move, this was B's biggest problem this game.
:w68: Since all surrounding B groups are alive, I'd seriously consider tenuki here. The slight chance of attacking B center group kinda goes away when you consider the fact that your own group is very weak. You would gain more if you treated it as a light group and played along top or left side. Move like F7 might be sente, and even if it's not, D11 is a nice way to pressure weak B group.
:w80: Should've blocked the other way. This mistake is pretty severe. You're not going to gain much from top, and you're destroying all potential W had on the left side.
:w88: Taking care of the weak center group is too slow here. It's still floating group that can't threaten anything surrounding it. Treat it as a light group and take profit along top. I'd accept the trade if I got the corner or big top if it meant death of W center group. That group has long since stopped working for you.
:w126: This would've been easier for you if you blocked the other way. After this move, a semeai started. The most noteworthy mistake here was 150. It should've been at J18 instead. The overall story there was that both should have lived, then B made a mistake and died, then W made several mistakes in a row first allowing B to live, and then eventually W died. Then eventually W killed 2 B groups and lived.

Author:  BaoTran [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 6:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A super thrilling fighting game

StlenVlr wrote:
The best I can tell, the game was ultra blitz with 10min absolute time, and the game ending with W being dead from move 182 to 192, then B making 150pt misplay and losing semeai that's roughly half the board worth.

Such games are not often that useful for reviewing purposes. It's very difficult to critique games when obviously driving factor behind every misplay was lack of time to think. You kinda could give hints to finding good direction of play, but with games that are only about fighting and close semeais, that aspect is overshadowed by the required intuition and flash reading, neither of which you can really communicate to another person.

That being said, here's list of things about direction of play I think you should pay attention to:

:w30: White should extend along the bot, maybe with L4. You don't have any good opportunities to develop your shape on the right side, but you'd really like getting some profit from this fight. take the profit.
:b61: B missed the opportunity to kill W(or completely destroy W corner) here. Before this, B spend many moves on center group instead of playing Q13. Outside the 193 move, this was B's biggest problem this game.
:w68: Since all surrounding B groups are alive, I'd seriously consider tenuki here. The slight chance of attacking B center group kinda goes away when you consider the fact that your own group is very weak. You would gain more if you treated it as a light group and played along top or left side. Move like F7 might be sente, and even if it's not, D11 is a nice way to pressure weak B group.
:w80: Should've blocked the other way. This mistake is pretty severe. You're not going to gain much from top, and you're destroying all potential W had on the left side.
:w88: Taking care of the weak center group is too slow here. It's still floating group that can't threaten anything surrounding it. Treat it as a light group and take profit along top. I'd accept the trade if I got the corner or big top if it meant death of W center group. That group has long since stopped working for you.
:w126: This would've been easier for you if you blocked the other way. After this move, a semeai started. The most noteworthy mistake here was 150. It should've been at J18 instead. The overall story there was that both should have lived, then B made a mistake and died, then W made several mistakes in a row first allowing B to live, and then eventually W died. Then eventually W killed 2 B groups and lived.


Thanks for the comments.

Here was just my thought process at W80. I chose to block that way because of
(1)sente and
(2)the resulting wall would provide more support to my O11 group.

If i blocked the other way, B would have sente to attack my O11 group while
(1)naturally gaining territory at top and
(2)strengthening his K10 group which
(3)would make the invasion to my left easier anyway.

Normally that's a mistake in direction but in this case I don't think so.

Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/