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Fighting game http://prod.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=7121 |
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Author: | NoSkill [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 4:06 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Fighting game | ||
I made a few mistakes during the fight, which i comment on. Any additional comments?
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Author: | NoSkill [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 5:04 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
a kind 4D reviewed the game for me on kgs... and so i think i know alot of my problems. Part of them was the fact i was blitzing when i had 20 minutes... opponent finished game in byomi and i had 10 min left.. |
Author: | Uberdude [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 5:12 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Why should I put more effort into thinking about your game than you can be bothered to? |
Author: | Redundant [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 5:30 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Uberdude wrote: Why should I put more effort into thinking about your game than you can be bothered to? Putting a game up for review puts you in no obligation to review it, so this is needlessly catty. I'm not even the OP, but this sort of comment is a net negative on the civility of this forum. |
Author: | Bill Spight [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 6:43 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
A few comments. ![]() Edit: Added variation for ![]() ![]() |
Author: | jts [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 6:59 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Redundant wrote: Uberdude wrote: Why should I put more effort into thinking about your game than you can be bothered to? Putting a game up for review puts you in no obligation to review it, so this is needlessly catty. I'm not even the OP, but this sort of comment is a net negative on the civility of this forum. I think that given the huge amount of support that Uberdude gives to players who ask for help, in reviews and otherwise, he could post compromising photos of your mother and still be a net positive to the civility of this forum. |
Author: | cyclops [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:02 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
You like your position after your w30? 10 stones taking some third line territory on the upperside, 4 stones in the bottom left radiating influence towards black strength. Compare this with the superior shape of b's stones. So yeah, P5 was premature. But to be honest I doubt the whole w strategy allowing b lines along top and the right. Black seems to me a quite strong player but he could have ended the game at 121@O5 ( if my reading is correct ). Though I agree with Redundant I also agree with Uberdude that spending some time to think won't harm. Just imagine him thinking about his next move in his Malkovitsch game against Magicwand if you need some inspiration. |
Author: | NoSkill [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:10 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
cyclops wrote: You like your position after your w30? 10 stones taking some third line territory on the upperside, 4 stones in the bottom left radiating influence towards black strength. Compare this with the superior shape of b's stones. So yeah, P5 was premature. But to be honest I doubt the whole w strategy allowing b lines along top and the right. Black seems to me a quite strong player but he could have ended the game at 121@O5 ( if my reading is correct ). Though I agree with Redundant I also agree with Uberdude that spending some time to think won't harm. Just imagine him thinking about his next move in his Malkovitsch game against Magicwand if you need some inspiration. Please stop acting like you are good or know better as a 7k. Uberdude is annoying to me and im going to censor him as all he does is talk big and be useless. For one thing 121 @05= does not work. yes w should have died, but no not that way. And yes the position at 30 is even i think, not bad for white or black. Please dont try to review a game of someone 5 stones stronger than you |
Author: | NoSkill [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:15 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Bill Spight wrote: A few comments. ![]() Edit: Added variation for ![]() ![]() Thanks for the tips ^^. The moves around 45 or so where i split the weak group off is something i noticed in the review from the 4D, very obvious mistake by me ![]() |
Author: | Redundant [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 10:28 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
jts wrote: I think that given the huge amount of support that Uberdude gives to players who ask for help, in reviews and otherwise, he could post compromising photos of your mother and still be a net positive to the civility of this forum. That's no excuse to be antagonistic to someone posting for help. He could have just said politely that Noskill should take longer, but instead posted what he did. There's no excuse to be rude. Ever. This forum has a disturbing habit of allowing its celebrities to get away with being downright rude at times, but that's another topic. |
Author: | NoSkill [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:32 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Redundant wrote: jts wrote: I think that given the huge amount of support that Uberdude gives to players who ask for help, in reviews and otherwise, he could post compromising photos of your mother and still be a net positive to the civility of this forum. That's no excuse to be antagonistic to someone posting for help. He could have just said politely that Noskill should take longer, but instead posted what he did. There's no excuse to be rude. Ever. This forum has a disturbing habit of allowing its celebrities to get away with being downright rude at times, but that's another topic. I agree with this statement. I would have no problem with uberdude still if he would admit he messes up but several times he has posted things basically saying he wasnt going to help in threads ive made. I could take longer and fix some mistakes yes, but there is a benefit to seeing mistkaes you only make in blitz. It means those mistakes are wrong instinccts, and something is a common mistake in all your games. A 4D can probably review my game in 10 minutes including DL and UL... so I also don't see why uberdude says "take the time to review your game" when it won't hardly take anytime. However, yes it is a bit rude of me to post a game which I didnt use all of my clock on, but Im not forcing anyone to review it nor would I be mad if anyone made only one or two comments on moves. My problem is with people who have attidue and don't help. If you have a bad attitude but help, it might just be your personality or whatever (IE robert jasiek to me is a little iffy with comments, but very helpful). Some people are nice and try to help but completely miss the mark, and those people should be treated with respect more than those who have attitude and don't help |
Author: | cyclops [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 5:24 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
NoSkill wrote: ....... Please dont try to review a game of someone 5 stones stronger than you I don't hide that I am 7 kyu. So feel free to skip or ignore my comments or indicate you don't want them from the beginning. I didn't see you were 1 dan. It was not in the game information and you are not known at KGS. I should have stayed out of that time discussion. Sorry for that. But I really don't like your position after w30. After reading Spight's comments I understood better what caused it's inferiority. Though 20 and 22 seemed suspicious to me as did the joseki in the upperright. Even if I didn't find the killing move in the bottom right it is obvious your invasion at the right is an uphill fight probably chosen because you felt behind. But, sure, my insights are of doubtfull value. Better so? |
Author: | NoSkill [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 6:17 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
cyclops wrote: NoSkill wrote: ....... Please dont try to review a game of someone 5 stones stronger than you I don't hide that I am 7 kyu. So feel free to skip or ignore my comments or indicate you don't want them from the beginning. I didn't see you were 1 dan. It was not in the game information and you are not known at KGS. I should have stayed out of that time discussion. Sorry for that. But I really don't like your position after w30. After reading Spight's comments I understood better what caused it's inferiority. Though 20 and 22 seemed suspicious to me as did the joseki in the upperright. Even if I didn't find the killing move in the bottom right it is obvious your invasion at the right is an uphill fight probably chosen because you felt behind. But, sure, my insights are of doubtfull value. Better so? I understand you are 7k and normally wouldnt mind anyone trying to help and would be kind but your first comment was a bit rude, sorry for being a bit mean on that point. After the joseki in the top right it is fine for white as well as black, its a moyo vs territory game. W30 was a bit questionable, but the game is still not bad for white, still even. My invasion wasn't thought out true. I didnt chose it because I was behind though, i built the wall in the middle by letting black into my moyo in order to invade the right, it was planned to invade it. |
Author: | NoSkill [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 6:32 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Dont have time to post it now, but my resign was a bit early. I could have made the bottom black group into a ko and had another chance to win still fyi. Or better yet, when i caused a ko in the lower left after he misread, i could have a made a double ko. |
Author: | Uberdude [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:17 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Apologies for the curtness of my post, I was just posing a rhetorical question to make a point. Redundant wrote: jts wrote: I think that given the huge amount of support that Uberdude gives to players who ask for help, in reviews and otherwise, he could post compromising photos of your mother and still be a net positive to the civility of this forum. That's no excuse to be antagonistic to someone posting for help. He could have just said politely that Noskill should take longer, but instead posted what he did. There's no excuse to be rude. Ever. I agree with this too. ![]() NoSkill wrote: A 4D can probably review my game in 10 minutes including DL and UL... so I also don't see why uberdude says "take the time to review your game" when it won't hardly take anytime. When I review games, particularly the opening, I will often do a pattern search of the shapes to find similar pro games in GoGoD to give higher quality comments that are informed by professional play. NoSkill wrote: Uberdude is annoying to me and im going to censor him as all he does is talk big and be useless. But this I disagree with. And 497 posts and 254 likes suggests much of L19 disagrees with you. NoSkill wrote: I would have no problem with uberdude still if he would admit he messes up but several times he has posted things basically saying he wasnt going to help in threads ive made. Really? I wasn't aware of that any prior friction between us so looked up our last few interactions: Uberdude wrote: NoSkill wrote: Anyone know if there is a better joskei choice than 21 that utilizes the top right? Just attach at c17 and play a normal joseki. Your question seems to imply that you want to make a moyo on the top side to use your top right shimari. But that's not the only way to use those stones. Another is to simply share the top left corner with white, preventing him from getting lots of territory there (and of course separate the pincer stone from the corner because Go is all about separating/connecting). If white ends up developing along the top side, that's nothing to be sad about: your strong shimari means he can't make much territory there. You need to be more flexible and let the game develop naturally, if you single-purposefully go after one thing, a skilled opponent can take advantage of that and force you to overcommit to your plan (e.g. forcing overconcentration). Was that useless? I thought it could give you a new way of thinking about the opening which could help you. At least some other people liked it. Uberdude wrote: NoSkill wrote: Interesing. What was played in game is taught as the only route for joseki, as seen on eidogo.com . I don't know what to think about the alternatives ![]() Another entry for viewtopic.php?f=15&t=6571 then. Maybe this the offending post? Ok, I didn't give you a game review, but after ez4u explained a mistake in joseki I linked to a thread collecting errors in Kogo's Joseki Dictionary as a warning that one should not blindly believe Kogo's/Eidogo. Useless? NoSkill wrote: Uberdude wrote: It's not the most up-to-date (about 10 years old) but this Korean style fuseki book has a chapter on exactly that approach probe you asked about. Also I (and more importantly the many pros who have played it) disagree with rlaalwso that ![]() There is also Takao's newer joseki dictionary, but that's just joseki not fuseki. I really like that Korean fuseki book and credit it with a large part of my fuseki understanding. I think it would be a good fit for the self-professed gaps in NoSkill's game. Oh really? I need to look over that book alot more ![]() That doesn't sound like a response to a useless post. Uberdude wrote: Simba wrote: Uberdude wrote: One of the specific techniques most 1 dans lack that 6 dans have is playing a type of moyo expansion/solidification move that prevents a reduction. They are often large knight moves towards the centre. Some Korean player said mastering this idea was mainly what took him from 5 dan to 6 dan. By this, do you mean things like the expansion from a low shimari on P17/R16 to O14 you played in that game on OGS ![]() Uberdude wrote: There are lots of books about the opening, read them. Ok, so my tone here could be interpreted as rather abrupt, but I honestly believe that if you are bad at opening reading opening books is useful. |
Author: | Magicwand [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:31 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Redundant wrote: jts wrote: I think that given the huge amount of support that Uberdude gives to players who ask for help, in reviews and otherwise, he could post compromising photos of your mother and still be a net positive to the civility of this forum. That's no excuse to be antagonistic to someone posting for help. He could have just said politely that Noskill should take longer, but instead posted what he did. There's no excuse to be rude. Ever. This forum has a disturbing habit of allowing its celebrities to get away with being downright rude at times, but that's another topic. Let's be fair. Uberdude's comment was not antagonistic. NoSkill wrote: a kind 4D reviewed the game for me on kgs... and so i think i know alot of my problems. Part of them was the fact i was blitzing when i had 20 minutes... opponent finished game in byomi and i had 10 min left.. Above quote sound like ddk Robert J His problem is that he doesnt know what his problem is. Be humble and say I suck at this game then we will better help you. |
Author: | NoSkill [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:44 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
My only other problem with you uberdude was on this thread: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=5099&start=20 But that is only because I never realized you responded again. I thought you just told me to read deeper and I did and you didn't respond. So much of the problem between us was my fault for misunderstanding, sorry for my comments. I get offended by a lot of people's on this forums attitude, possibly a personal problem or maybe because some people don't speak english as the first language, like magicwand. I can't tell if they are insulting you or just being abrupt or don't know english well. I think I need to read with more care to realize people probably aren't insulting me for no reason. |
Author: | Redundant [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:33 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
@Magicwand: Uberdude's post has a very combative connotation to it. The phrase "than you can be bothered to" is antagonistic. Uberdude is a native speaker, so I wouldn't let him off the hook for his choice of phrasing. |
Author: | NoSkill [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 5:29 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
Redundant wrote: @Magicwand: Uberdude's post has a very combative connotation to it. The phrase "than you can be bothered to" is antagonistic. Uberdude is a native speaker, so I wouldn't let him off the hook for his choice of phrasing. This is true but if he is willing to move forward like he seems to I am fine and admit I did have a previous bad ill-will towards him that was my fault. Magicwand also does this sometimes, but i think it is because he doesn't realize the way his english comes off so I forgive him. Anyway we can just pretty much sum up I got this game reviewed good and thank everybody for helping ![]() |
Author: | cyclops [ Tue Nov 06, 2012 7:36 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Fighting game |
culture is another factor. In some cultures it is rude to say anything that might cause discomfort or can be interpreted as belittling the other. Other cultures are more straightforward. I guess the dutch, the germans and the koreans are more of the straightforward type. |
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